61. You Will Leave People Behind
Many people think they’re ready to embark on their D.E.I. journey, and they may be ready, but it’s important that they know what to expect and that they consider the cost before diving in.
Expect this to be a rough ride and to meet with resistance. In fact, Erica + India’s own growth journeys have resulted in dear ones moving away from them. It’s also meant them leaving others behind. There has been a lot of pain in the journey.
But they’ve also found joy as they’ve built their tribe.
That’s why they preach about not self-isolating while doing this work. This is the reason why they created the Pause on the Play Community. Being there for one another on this exciting yet painful journey provides camaraderie, joy, and lightens the load for all of us.
Are you ready to listen in? What’s Happening In This Episode
[0:00:42] Not everyone can come along for the ride.
[0:03:20] The painful reality of losing business, friends, and family over beliefs
[0:06:58] Be prepared for this potentially painful journey. Don’t self-isolate.
[0:10:01] The cost of a lack of social support
[0:11:51] When the going gets tough and you see little progress...
[0:13:22] It’s crucial to have a support network. A glimpse of Erica + India’s support for one another
[0:16:40] Drop the tags and get in action.
[0:18:05] Find some joy in the journey
[0:19:02] The support from the Pause on the Play Community
[0:21:57] Choosing your support system
WHAT’S ONE ACTION YOU CAN TAKE AWAY FROM THE DISCUSSION?
“We could focus on losing people, but you also have to ask yourself who do you want to gain.” + India
QUOTES
“The right thing is usually not the easy thing.” + Erica
“You’re going to leave people behind, and people will leave you behind.” + India
“This is a long-game process. We got her over generations of trauma. We don’t get out of here from just a couple of weeks.” + Erica
“None of us are above having work to do. If your focus is a damn tag to call yourself, that’s proof that you’ve got work to do.” + Erica
“It is wasting a life that you have to live to only stay in the hard and heavy parts.” + Erica
“Being in tears is not helping anybody. You do need to process your feelings, but we also need you to feel whole and to be able to recover from those feelings in order to keep doing the work.” + India
“There is so much support that you gain when you invite yourself into aligned people.” + India
“I’ve had to rebuild what family looks like for me as an adult through the people I selected to be my family instead of my family of origin. That came from having that support system.” + India
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Transcript
Erica: Hello, hello. And welcome back to Pause on the Play. It is amazing to see you here where you are challenged to examine your beliefs, question your predisposed notions, and consider realities you may have been unfamiliar with in order to understand that they too are real. I am your host and conversation emcee for the day, Erica Courdae here along with my cohost, India Jackson, to get the dialog going. What's up, India?
India: What's up?
Erica: There's a lot that is shifting when it comes to what people are doing, how they're showing up, and a little bit of a different level of accountability that some people are stepping into taking when it comes to their business, their brand, and how they as an individual, a human, are showing up. And with that, I think it's important to acknowledge that this is not easy. And everybody can't come for the ride.
We have a very old episode about that.
India: Real old.
Erica: In podcast years, it's like 82 years. It's old, but it is accurate because everybody can't come for the ride. I'm not bringing this just because I want you to think about it. I'm also saying this from a true place of empathy because I've had people that I have had to not bring along for the ride. I have had a number of people throughout my life that as I have evolved, I just could no longer be a whole human being and still have them there. And as I began to step into my work, I had to be very clear about what was okay and what wasn't. Part of it is what I do from the ethical side. But part of it is also, whether it's time or effort that has to go into it, some people just aren't on board with it. And they have a different standard or different idea of what it should be, and I'm not here to do what anybody else thinks I need to do for me. Or to be an example for my kids or to be the voice that people are listening to, because people are listening.
So my responsibility to that is important, and I think with that, it's important to bring to you the fact that when you step into this, there are some things that are going to happen, but you don't have to isolate. You don't have to do it alone.
What comes up in your head when I say all this stuff?
India: I think that any time we're stepping into using our voice, using our power, being visible, bringing visibility to the things that we believe in, you're going to have people that don't believe the same thing. There's no way around that. What you said is true. People are going to get off the ride of your life. They're going to slowly start to distance themselves. And dare I say even you might decide to distance yourself from some people because you have given them the space to see that they could change some things or evolve in certain ways, and they're not open to it. Or you realize maybe they're fucking racists. Or maybe they're sexist. Or maybe they abuse power. And that's not okay with you.
I know many people here are here because they own a business, but it goes so much deeper than that. When we started really stepping into our values and beliefs, both of us -- you and I, Erica -- and having to really stand up and say that we weren't going to be silent anymore about certain things, we lost a lot of people. And some places, that started with business. But that trickles down to family and friends too. And that's real. And it's not easy. And it can be very painful to wake up and realize that people you were close to you can no longer be close to anymore because it's no longer healthy for you. Or it no longer facilitates safety for the other people you're close to that don't look like them or don't think like them or don't move through life like them.
We've had a lot of people get off the ride.
Erica: Yeah. Honestly, the sigh really sums all of it up because it is a lot, and it takes a lot of energy, and it's not easy. What I think that people have to remind themselves of is that the right thing is usually not the easy thing. It just happens to be that way. It's not only what is the right thing for you, but what is the right thing as a whole.
So when you step into your diversity, equity, and inclusion work, it really is you saying "I'm no longer willing to commit to being racist because I won't commit to be anti-racist." It's the right thing to do, and it's not easy.
I feel like the things that can come up with that, I feel like there's a few things around it. So I feel like when you start with just that entire piece of "You're going to lose people," or "This person can't come for the ride," this is going to include friends. It's going to include family.
India: You're going to leave people behind. People will leave you behind. And I think it's important that for a lot of people who are stepping into this work for the first time in their lives is to be prepared for that and be ready because then maybe it won't sting just as hard when it happens.
Erica: Yeah, you're slightly more prepared for it. I don't think you're ever truly prepared, but at least you won't feel totally blindsided. To me, one of the things that makes any type of loss like that the hardest, what makes that hard is when you have to do it by yourself. So this is where I like to remind people that isolating is not helpful.
It is one thing to need to give yourself space to heal or just that time, but you want to be careful to not truly isolate because it's not going to be helpful to sit in it and just stew on your on. These are the points when it gets hard. And this is where having support, having people that you can do this with, people that can help you with accountability, even if that accountability is reminding you to go drink water... I'm being honest. The smallest of things.
There were a number of things that were popping up reminding people if you were protesting to bring water. It seems like a small thing, but honestly, your normal basic needs, they don't always take the same precedence sometimes. And so when things come up and it gets hard, you can forget some of those things.
That accountability from someone to be like "Did you eat? Did you drink? Did you turn off social media?" Whatever that thing is that needs to happen. And that's just the human piece of it. There's a whole other layer when it comes to accountability when you're talking about from the business front.
But on the human level, I want it to be understood as well that -- and I always talk about this -- I'm not here to shame you. You are choosing to do something to make things better for people that look like me, for people that don't look like you. And you don't have to do that. You can just choose to stay in the racist system that benefits you by birthright. And when you choose not to, you're human. So while I'm not going to just give a pass for bad behavior, yes, and you're a human, and I have empathy for the fact that you are stepping into something that is not easy. So I'm not going to put your needs on the bottom rung because you were born into a system that you didn't have a say into either.
The thing is you are now choosing that you no longer want to be silently complicit in that. Shit. You're still human. I'm still human. I didn't lose that part when I decided to do anti-racism work. You're still human, and that's okay.
India: I think that the other side of that accountability is when you don't have the support of someone to guide you along and to make sure that you're still taking care of yourself, you're still taking care of your business. You run the risk of a few things, from what I've seen, which, A, is really being in a place where you start to shrink yourself in order to make these people that probably you just need to let go of feel better. That's not okay.
And, B, if we don't watch that, then we burn ourselves out. And burnout leads to throwing in the towel. We need you in this for the long haul. This isn't a one week, a one phone call with Erica, a one month of our community thing. This is a long-game process. We got here over generations and generations and generations of trauma. We don't get out of here from just a couple of weeks. So we don't need you burning yourself out and throwing in the towel.
Erica: And that's where it's important to remember that, India, what you said is exactly right. One call with me, one month with me, one month in our community, a call with us together, that's not enough because you don't overturn full programming that you've gotten from day one out of the womb, you don't shake that overnight. So it's important to remember that. But I think it's important to remember it for when it gets hard. I think it's important to remember that when you feel like you're not making enough progress. I think it's important to remember that when that piece of you that might be very outcome-driven or focus-driven, it's like, okay, where's the thing? I don't see the shift. I don't see the change, the outcome. And it's not a check the box. "Alright, I picked that up off the floor. Check. Now what?"
It's not just that simple that you do this action and you're going to automatically see the clouds part and the sun comes out. It's diligence, and it is dedication. Don't give up. But also be easy with yourself when you are doing it because you are not going to uncover 20, 30, 40, 50-plus, 60-plus years of white supremacist programming in one 60-minute call. Not going to do that. That's setting an unrealistic expectation for anti-racist work, but it's also setting an unrealistic expectation for your capacity to change, to even realize what needs to be changed. That can't happen.
You can't even recognize everything that needs to be changed. How do you think you're going to change it that fast.
So you have to really give yourself that space, and that's exactly why you need to do it with support. You need to have a network. You need to have people to lean on. I'm going to remind everyone, particularly those that are new, that what you saw happened as you began to interact with my content. What you were seeing forward-facing on any social media platform, for the most part, came because India's company Flaunt Your Fire does my forward-facing marketing.
Now, I write my stuff, but as far as the curation of it and the posting and the strategy, the purpose, and making sure that I'm not out here doing wild shit because sometimes I get pissed and I just be saying shit, but that is her.
The weekend after George Floyd was murdered, I was knee-deep in this in the most energy-sucking kind of way. And nothing would have been there if it was not for her. This is not the only time, but this is an example that is really easy for you to see that is recent.
I don't do this alone, and that is not me even touching on the fact that we have been friends for well over 12 years, and from an emotional standpoint, she has helped to keep me whole when this shit drains me, and I am dealing with brain picking and passive-aggressive responses and lack of accountability and even just some full-blown articulate racists.
India: Yeah.
Erica: It is what it is. It's hard.
India: I'm going to say that there's a lot that goes on behind the scenes. First of all, thank you for acknowledging the work that I do, but I'm also going to say for those of you listening, there's a lot that goes behind the scenes that Erica is experiencing that you don't get to see. And not all of it is pretty. A lot of it isn't.
Erica: I could not do this alone. I could not. There's absolutely no way on this earth that I could. None. Because I need to be supported as a human being. I am running a business to facilitates my values. And so I need help to keep that business running. And that is multiple pieces.
It is a lot. And so when people jump into "I want to be an ally. I want to be a co-conspirator. I want to be an accomplice."
I've said this before, and I'll say it again, I know that there is a lot of things, and this is where I'm going to say I'm struggling with this "I need to call myself something" thing. Call yourself in action. Go fucking do something. If you're arguing about this goddamn tag, you're focusing on the wrong shit. Go do the thing. Go do the goddamn thing. Because I don't care what you call yourself, you've still got work to do.
All of us, including me. I have to deprogram myself as well.
So none of us are above having work to do. So if your focus is a damn tag to call yourself, that's proof that you've got work to do. You can't get to any level at all by yourself, not keeping yourself sane and whole because there are times that it gets difficult. People are going to disagree with you because there's no one way.
India: Stop and join the conversation.
Erica: That happens a lot. You've been indoctrinated into what happens here.
India: [Inaudible 0:17:42] with Erica, literally.
Erica: [Inaudible 0:17:45]. It was funny. The last time it was mine. I was like I'm just going to kind of shut that down. I ate too. I was like, oh, well. I can't help it.
Can I also acknowledge you have to laugh sometimes. You have to find joy, dammit, find some joy, because it is wasting a life that you have to live to only stay in the hard and heavy parts as if you have to martyr yourself and you have to beat yourself up. Because if I didn't laugh, I'd be in fucking tears all the time.
India: Can I remind you being in tears is not helping anybody. You do need to process your feelings, but we also need you to feel whole and to be able to recover from those feelings in order to keep doing the work.
It's even hard for me to bring words to how I feel because it's so intense about how I've seen our community support each other, how I've seen Pause on the Play Community support you, Erica, at a time like this, coming and asking how you're doing. We're the facilitators, but just the love in the room for both of us has been immense.
Also, I've seen them supporting each other, and I've seen them buying from each other, buying products and services and referring people to each other's business because -- guess what -- our businesses still need to make money in order to be able to thrive. And it's that money that changes the economic gap.
And I also have seen the power of their willingness to share each other's posts, the share each other's stories. There's just so much support that you gain when you invite yourself into aligned people.
So, yes, I know we said in the beginning, you're going to lose people, and we have too. We've been there with you, and we have complete empathy for how hard that has been. We both have had to set aside family members in our journey. Very close, immediate family members in our journey because it was no longer healthy to continue to have them around. So I just want to give that context without talking around the problem and saying for what it is. We have lost... I in particular have had to lose a parent due to misaligned values.
Erica: Same. A parent, a best friend. I don't know how many other people have fallen behind the wayside along the way that were friends, family, business associates, cohorts, just people that were no longer aligned.
India: Not one of those was easy. Not one of them. So I want you to know, if you're hearing what Erica is saying, if you're hearing what I'm saying, we're not saying this because we're putting this on you and we haven't had to do the same thing. We have. We've had to do some very difficult decisions in our lives to get to where we are.
And I also want to say that we positioned ourselves. We've practiced what we preach to have that accountability in each other and in the other service providers that we work with so that we don't throw in the towel. We've had that support of our own community and surrounding ourselves with people who do have similar values in belief systems so that this does become easier. Because, guess what, we all need to be human. We do need a laugh. We do need to have fun. We do need to feel like we have friends and family and support.
Without going too much off-topic, I've had to rebuild what family looks like for me as an adult through the people I selected to be my family instead of my family of origin. And that came from having that support system.
Erica: What you said is powerful because you chose what you wanted family to be. And none of us get to choose family from the word go, but as you begin to choose who you want to be, there is a lot of power in choosing who you are asking to hold you accountable, what you are asking to hold your hair back when it gets hard, who you are asking for support when you need it because these are things that we need. We're pack animals as humans. We seek and we crave that.
And so when you are stepping into being the next best version of you, who are you choosing to support you? And that's what Pause on the Play is really all about within our community.
India: Absolutely. Yes, we could focus on the losing people, but you also have to ask yourself, "Who do you want to gain?"
Erica: If you're looking to gain the people that want to see you thrive, that have similar values that they're looking to bring to light, that are looking to speak openly and honestly and frankly about the things that need to be talked about out loud, that are looking to support you and to share your business with people that are going to purchase your services and help to give you the visibility with the right types of people, to give you opportunities, this is what the community is all about. And the community is not complete without you.
Go over to PauseOnThePlay.com, and you can go ahead and apply to be in the community. If you're not sure what is the next best step for you, go over the EricaCourdae.com and sign up for your free consultation, and we can discuss what is the next best step for you in your journey.
The entire point of everything that we do is to really get you to be willing to ask the right questions, to dig deeper, and to have the conversations just like I'm having with India. And for that, I appreciate you for listening.
If you could think of anything that you want to send everyone off before we go, India, what do you want to do?
India: I just want to remind you that D.E.I. Work, you think you stepped into D.E.I. For visibility for your business, but it touches so many other areas of life than just that, including your family, your friends, how you move through life. And if you're finding yourself in that place where this has touched you and you felt the feels, you're not alone. We understand, and we're here for you.
Erica: Again, he on over to PauseOnThePlay.com if you want to go ahead and apply for the community now. If you're not sure, go over to EricaCourdae.com, schedule your free consultation, and we'll discuss what is best for you right now.
As always, we appreciate you being here, and until next time...